JS Party – Episode #151

Frontend Feud: HalfStack Edition

with guests Jem Young & Neil Roberts

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Frontend Feud returns! Emma heads up team Boooooleans đź‘» and Nick captains the Whiteboard Interviews Millionaires. We played this game for our friends at HalfStack Conf and the full video of the session is on our YouTube channel too. Take the survey!

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Hello, and welcome. I am Jerod Santo, and we’re happy to be participating once again in HalfStack Online. If you attended the last time around, you may or may not have seen us play JS Danger. That’s our don’t-call-it-Jeopardy game show. What you’re about to witness is our don’t-call-it-Family-Feud game show. Those familiar with the American television game show will know how the game works, but for everyone else, this is how we play.

We have surveyed 112 JS Party listeners, and asked them various questions about frontend development, life as a developer, stuff like that… And our participants here are two teams who will battle to try to match as many surveys as possible. So we are split up into teams… We have team Emma, and because HalfStack is Halloween-themed this time around, our team names are also Halloween-themed. Emma, please introduce your team name and the members of your team.

Hello, everyone. I’m Emma and we are Team Boooooleans… I hate saying that loud. It sounded better in writing. But anyway, I am joined by the lovely Divya. Divya, do you want to say hello?

Hellooooooooo!

[laughs] And I’m also joined by a guest team member, Neil.

Hi! It’s an honor just to be nominated. [laughter]

Well, the pleasure is all yours, Neil. We also have Nick here as well. Now, Emma’s team actually won Frontend Feud last time around, but Nick’s team also won, because Nick, you were on Emma’s team last time. So we have two returning champs, but now you’re forced to do battle. Nick, please introduce your team name and your team members.

Thank you, Jerod. Yes, we are Team Whiteboard Interviews.

Spooky…! That is scary.

And on my team today is Amal. Amal, how’s it going?

Hi! I’m still laughing from Neil’s joke. I’m gonna steal that one. It is an honor indeed just to be nominated. [laughter]

Indeed. And we also have a special guest, and that is Jem Young. Jem, would you like to introduce yourself?

Hello! Thanks, Nick, and thanks for having me on. I just wanna say, you’re gonna regret having me on your team. Just letting you know that… [laughter]

[00:04:15.06] We already do… Alright, well let’s feud, shall we? First up in the battle round – the battle round works with two contestants, one from each team, comes up and tries to match the highest surveyed response. Whoever goes highest on the board gets to win the board, and they can either play or pass. First up, we have team captains Emma versus Nick. Step right up…

You will buzz in when you think you have an answer. You can buzz in by saying “Buzz!”, “Bzz!”, “FizzBuzz!”, or any sound that makes me think that you buzzed. Are you ready?

Oh, yeah.

Okay. Name something frontend devs complain about.

Buzz!

Oh, shoot, that was a simultaneous buzz. I’m gonna give it to Emma, because she said it louder.

I’m gonna say meetings.

Survey says… [fail sound]

Seriously?!

Oh… Yeah, you know what? I think that was a really good answer, but I feel like I’m gonna channel my inner grandma. I think we can nail this one, team…

Okay. Nick, now it defaults to you. What is something that frontend devs complain about?

Everything. Just kidding. [laughter]

Amal… It’s not your turn… [laughs]

Wives… Just joking.

Sorry, Nick? Say it again, Nick? I can’t hear you.

I said code.

Code… Not quite specific enough. I’m not gonna give that to you. [fail sound] Back to Emma… This is starting like the last game.

Okay, real quick though, Jerod… Before I say my answer, we have to quarantine Amal, if she’s gonna keep saying things… Because to be fair, that could have been one of the answers. Just saying. I don’t play dirty.

Alright. Amal, please stay in your corner until you’re called upon.

Okay. Sorry. You have to understand, everybody, I am the child of African immigrants. We don’t really do good with rules. We make our own rules in my house, okay…? [laughs]

We might have to introduce a mute button. Okay. Emma, back to you?

How about non-semantic HTML? [fail sound] Okay, whoever you’re interviewing is a terrible developer…

I’m sorry, but you guys are being way too specific…

This is going about as well as the last time.

You said he wasn’t specific enough…

This is exactly how the last game started… Oh, is that what I said? [laughter] Nick, back to you… Please, save us. Well, it’s just a battle round; one of you two have to hit one, and then we’ll go to the rest of the players. Come on, Nick. You can do it.

Do we have a question for how many engineers does it take to figure out this game? [laughter]

This is 112 people… Surely, you can match some of them. Name something frontend devs complain about, Nick, please… Please, name something.

Co-workers.

Oh, goodness… I’m not gonna give that one to you either. [fail sound]

Oh, come on, Nick. I have so many!

You’re really close this time. You’re really close this time. Alright, Emma, back to you.

I think it must be all that TypeScript… [laughter]

Cheap shots from your own team… [laughter]

We’re a family…

How about their manager?

[fail sound] I’ll say that one just missed the board. It’s not on there, but you’re right on tight.

Oh, man… It’s back to me.

We have five things on the board…

Do I need to get [unintelligible 00:07:24.26]

Who made them captain…? [laughter]

Name something that frontend developers complain about.

Whose turn is it?

No, no, no!

This is Nick versus Emma here. [laughter]

Something that frontend developers complain about. They complain about JavaScript.

[win sound] Correct!

That’s Stockholm syndrome…

Arrghh! I have Stockholm syndrome. I live here. [laughter]

[00:07:54.00] So 15 people said either JavaScript, or JavaScript fatigue, something along those lines… And that’s correct. So you win the board, and you can now either play or pass. There are five things on the board. That was the number two answer. So you have one, three, four and five, and you have three strikes for your team to name those other four answers. Will you play or pass?

Let’s play.

You’re gonna play, okay. So we go from Nick to Jim… Jem, name something that frontend devs complain about.

Can I say frameworks?

Survey says… [fail sound] No, you cannot say frameworks. That’s 1x.

Aww…

You were so confident.

Okay, now we go to Amal. Amal, it’s your turn. Welcome. [laughter]

Amal has a long list…

Oh, so many things… Um, I would say styling CSS.

Survey says… [win sound]

Number one answer.

Nice!

Nice…

Number three answer, with 14 responses.

Amal’s not happy about that at all…

That was gonna be my next answer…

The number one, number four and number five answer are still on the board. We’re back to Nick, and your team has one strike, so you have two more strikes to give. Nick?

Oh, man… Let’s see. They complain about their editor.

[fail sound] I’m sorry, they did not make the cut. You now have two strikes, which means the game is in Jem’s hands. Jem?

Oh…

Last strike.

No pressure.

No pressure.

This is where I live for. Something frontend devs complain about… What do I complain about? Everything. But specifically frontend… I’m gonna go with writing tests.

Survey says… [fail sound] No…!

Aww…! You bum frontend devs not writing tests!

Hey, how can you complain about it when you never do it? [laughter]

That was good. That was a solid answer.

Thank you.

Okay, so now Team Boooooleans gets a chance to steal.

You’ve got this, Emma…

You have one guess…

No, it’s us. It’s us.

Oh, it’s us?

The team can confer. Yes, you get one guess.

I was thinking build tools.

I was gonna say WebPack, actually…

Let’s do it.

Hold on. Wait, wait, wait. We can confer with our team?

No, the other team is stealing from your team. Your team is done.

Amal, if you get all three wrong, we get a chance to steal it, we can talk about it, and then we give one answer. And if we get it right, we steal it all.

Oh, so you talk about it. I see.

Yeah, yeah.

They can only talk about it at the end, on the steal. And you get one guess.

Got it, got it.

So what are you going with here?

WebPack…

Yeah, build tools/WebPack.

Survey says… [fail sound] No…

Come on, really?!

I spend 90% of my time doing that.

That was a good one.

Oh, my gosh…

So the Team Whiteboard Interviews keeps their 29 points that they’ve scored. The number one answer, which nobody guessed, which will sound super-obvious in retrospect, is browser/IE/Safari compatibility etc.

Arrgh…!

This isn’t 1999…

Tell that to the survey respondents… The number four thing that frontend devs complain about is backend devs, with [unintelligible 00:10:54.06]

Wow, that’s some serious shade…

Really?! Wow, that’s shade…

And now we come full circle, because the number five answer - I heard it twice mentioned as a joke - they complain about everything. There are six people that complain about everything.

Oh, my god… That’s so general.

So those are the ones missed… Bosses and managers barely missed the board; there were six responses. Three people complained about Npm, two about WebPack, one about Vim, one about JIRA, one about lack of respect… So there’s a few other answers.

Okay…

These are really [unintelligible 00:11:28.10]

Yeah.

So that is round one… We now go to round two. It’s going to be our guests, Neil versus Jem. Gentlemen, step right up.

Alright, Neil, get your buzz ready.

So did we get points for that round?

Yes, you got 19 points.

Neil, just channel your inner frontend dev that doesn’t exist. [laughter]

Buzz as loudly as you can, even if you don’t know the answer.

Name something you might do on a Zoom meeting.

Buzz.

Jem, you buzzed in…

Neil, you had one job… [laughter]

Jem buzzed in immediately…

Something you do in a Zoom meeting would be tell someone that they’re muted.

[00:12:11.07] Survey says… [win sound] Number one answer, with 22.

Nice…

Nice job.

This covers both people who responded with muting and unmuting. So now both of those are gone. And since that was the number one answer, your team wins the board, and now you can just play or pass. Neil actually does not get a guess, so does team Whiteboard Interviews like to play this round or pass?

What do you think, team?

I think we can give it a whirl. We have nothing to lose.

Okay, so you guys are playing. We go to Amal. Amal, there are six total answers on the board. Jem has named the number one answer, so there’s five more left. What is something you might do on a Zoom meeting?

I would say screenshare…

Survey says… [fail sound]

Oh, no…!

It did not make the cut…

Okay… Wow. That’s a surprise.

Before we continue, I want Neil to know he’s been unnominated… [laughter] No, I’m sorry. I’m throwing shade. I’m just kidding.

It’s a moonlight moment… [laughter]

The pleasure is all his… Alright, Nick, word to you. You’ve got one strike, and there’s five things left on the board.

Okay… There’s an answer I want to give, but I don’t think it’s on there… I’m gonna say “Drink.” [laughter]

Survey says… [fail sound] No.

Really?!

Not even close. Okay, back to Jem. Apparently, the only one who’s good at this round… Jem?

We’re all drinking on this call; I just thought I’d say that though…

Some of us have more adult beverages than others… It’s fine.

Excuse me… I will have you know that coffee and tea is an adult beverage.

Fair enough…

So is water…

It’s a beverage for real adults…

So is water.

Yes… Jem, please name something on the board.

I just wanna say that the hate that I have for Emma is powering my answers right now… [laughter] I just want you to know that.

Really? Because in the first round you got it wrong. Just saying.

We just won the board already, so…

Alright, just tell us your answer, SmartyPants.

You have 20-something points. That’s a lot, right?

So something that people do on a Zoom meeting - I’m gonna say “Forget to turn off their video.”

Survey says… [win sound] Number two answer, with 11 responses. Now, that covers both camera off and camera on. So some people say “Turn it off”/“Turn it on”/“Forget to…” etc.

So that’s the number one–

My shoulder is so heavy with the burden that I’m carrying right now for my team… I’m just carrying my team on the back right now… [laughter]

Okay, Amal, it’s time for you to–

Wow, Jem. Alright.

Way to burn bridges.

…to participate here.

Alright, yeah. Let’s see, so what do people do on Zoom? So they mute and unmute, turn their camera on and off… They clearly don’t screenshare, apparently… I don’t know… I guess I’m the only one doing work on Zoom. [laughter] I don’t know, I’m gonna put a wild thing out there, which is like “Play with their virtual backgrounds/Change their backgrounds”, or whatever…

Oh, solid.

Survey says… [win sounds] Number four answer.

Solid answer.

Nice, nice.

Whoa, okay. Alright, thanks.

That’s worth nine points…

Oh, very nice, Neil.

Is that Sweden?!

I had it queued up for the steal.

Oh, that would have been great.

it’s like the Swedish Royal Palace.

Yeah. You get points, Neil.

[unintelligible 00:15:20.10]

Nick, we are back to you. There’s two strikes, and there are three answers left on the board.

No pressure.

No pressure… [laughs]

What do people do on a Zoom meeting?

They chat.

[win sound] Correct!

Wow…

Number three answer.

We’re just listing Zoom features at this point… [laughter]

We play Frontend Feud…

Sponsored by Zoom…

Sponsored by Zoom, yeah… [laughter]

My next answer, “They only pay $15/month.”

Right. Zoom doesn’t need to sponsor. They’re already everywhere. Okay, we’re down to the last two, number five and number six, so it’s gonna get a little harder here. We have one more strike. Back to you, Jem. You’re two for two right now; can you deliver?

Hm…

[00:16:04.22] You’re the best frontend developer ever, Jem… [laughter]

I know. What does that say about the state of frontend development…? [laughter] Something people do on a Zoom meeting… I guess for five and six we have to get meta, so I’m gonna say “Complain about video chat meetings.”

No way…

Survey says… [fail sound] Not on the board.

That was good. I liked that.

Too meta, too meta.

That’s three strikes…

I have an idea for the steal… What about asking if they can see my screen when screensharing? Like, “Can you see my screen?”

That’s a good one.

I was also thinking screen recording.

Yeah, same. I was thinking “Is it recording?”

Because I was listing their features…

…as a question. Because everyone asks that.

I think you guys are going down a dangerous path.

I don’t think so… Because screenshare is an action, and asking if someone can see your screen is a completely different thing.

Okay, okay…

Is that your guys’ final–

But was that related to the screen–

If this one gets it, Jerod, I’m just letting you know, I’m gonna contest…

No, but screenshare was mentioned already… So if that was not a subset of the previous one… I think Jerod assumes that if you say a word that’s a subset of a larger word, it counts…

Yes, I’ll group together [unintelligible 00:17:11.16]

Okay, fine.

Yeah, so it’s not screensharing.

Okay… So I guess, Divya, you’re probably right then.

Neil said the same thing. Neil and I are on the same frequency.

[laughs] She’s right, she’s right. We’re throwing shade at me, so I’m good. [laughter]

Neil was unnominated…

Wait, Emma, don’t you need Amal [unintelligible 00:17:23.17] I’m only saving you guys from this…

Stop helping them!

Sorry, sorry.

Yeah, seriously, Amal… Whose team are you on?

Yeah, okay. Sharing is caring. I’m on everybody’s team. I’m a platform engineer! Just kidding.

What’s your final answer, Team Boooooleans?

Screen recording.

Screen recording. And survey says… [fail sound] No. You’ve missed the steal.

Okay, can we–

I think just are not aware of all the features that Zoom offers. [laughter]

Well, the survey didn’t list out all the things…

Open up the Zoom preferences tab, everybody… [laughter]

You should have said “They quit after 40 minutes.”

The number five answer was “Check Twitter/Check crypto/Surf the web…” Basically, surf the web and do other things.

Not pay attention, yeah. That’s what I thought.

Right. And then the number six answer was actually “Work.” They just said “Work.”

What?!

Yeah, they work.

People work on Zoom…?!

I just wanna publicly state that your team is not winning because you get the answers right, you’re winning because no one’s getting anything right.

Hm… That’s meta.

I think we got a lot of points last round, if we’re counting…

Actually, that’s on you, Jerod; or the public, actually… I don’t know.

I didn’t come up with the answers, I just came up with the questions. So four people answered “Zone one/Sleep/ Take a nap”, two people said “Don’t wear pants”, two people said “Cry”, one person said “Play the ukulele”, “Show off my cat” was another common answer, and then “Check my pores”, which I thought was really kind of morbid, but anyways…

Weird.

That’s really weird… Also, I don’t think the fidelity is high enough for that… Is it? I don’t think so.

You’re real technical on that…

I feel like I’m always washed out on Zoom. [laughter]

Oh, my goodness… Nick, you just went super-zoom-in on your face… You have very nice pores.

I’m checking my pores.

Yeah. What kind of lotion do you use? That’s nice.

Oh, it’s too close…

So after two rounds, team Nick, a.k.a. Whiteboard Millionaires – what’s your team name? The Whiteboard Interviews? [laughter] Whiteboard Millionaires… I like that one better.

Whiteboard Millionaires… [laughs]

Yeah… Has 81. And Team Boooooleans has zerooooo… Okay.

Ooohh…

Boooo…

Break

[00:19:42.20]

Divya and Amal, you are now to battle off in our next round… Please step up to the board…

I have to battle my friend… This is so sad.

That’s right. Are you ready?

We put our friendship to the test…

I know.

We already have enemies on this call, so… We’ll see where we end up. [laughter]

Yeah, okay.

Okay, name something you learned, but never used in practice.

Buzz.

Okay, Amal buzzed in first.

I’m gonna say complex – a lot of frontend engineers are probably not doing a lot of data sciency… Not data sciency; they’re not using a lot of data structures. So I would say data structures, algorithms, red-black trees… That whole genre of stuff.

Good answer, good answer.

I’m gonna interpret that as data structures, and I’m gonna say… [win sound] That is the number two answer.

Nice.

Linked in that is link lists, B-trees etc.

Yeah, that’s what I was thinking, yeah.

Yup. So 13 people responded that. You have number two, but the number one is still on the board, so that means Divya does have a chance to name it, and she can steal the board.

Ooff… The question was around – can you say the question again?

Name something you learned, but never used in practice.

Data structures was already mentioned… Algorithms, I think. That’s the next one.

Algorithms. Survey says… [win sound] Number one answer.

Yeahhhh!

Hey, you know I said algorithms, right? I was like “Data structures, algorithms…”

You shouted a bunch of stuff… [laughter] You said a lot.

You named like six things. I had to go with the first thing.

The one time you should have said everything, you didn’t; and the one time you should have, you did. [laughs]

Yeah, yeah… You know what, Emma? Thanks… [laughter] That’s okay.

So Divya’s team steals the board. I assume, since you guys haven’t played yet, you wanna play this board? Team Divya and Emma?

Yeah, why not.

What do we have to lose, zero? [laughter]

Okay. So there’s four total answers on the board. You already have the number one and the number two answers… So you’re trying to hit three and four, and you have all three strikes to go… So we will go to now Emma. Your turn.

How about recursion?

Recursion. Survey says… [win sound] Yes, that’s the number four answer.

Very nice!

Nice!

Very nice. Five points there. You now have all but one…

We’re coming for you… [laughter]

And you’ve got all the three strikes to waste. We now go to Neil… Name something you learned, but never used in practice.

Oh, I don’t know… Probably that’s wrong… I studied computer engineering…

Well, lots of stuff then.

Machine code is one thing I learned, that I never used.

Is that your answer?

Okay. Survey says… [fail sound] Nope.

That’s a solid point though… If you learn computer science, it’ll generally teach you Assembly language.

Yeah, something like that.

Yeah, not a bad guess at all. But a strike nonetheless. We now go back to Divya, trying to hit that last number three…

Oh, man… He is on… Hm. Functional programming.

Functional programming. And the survey says…

A thousand fairies just died…. [laughter]

[fail sound]

I was gonna say Elm, but I didn’t wanna throw a shade, so… [laughter]

Okay… So not on there, functional programming, but there is one answer left, and we’re back to Emma.

I was gonna guess that, for what it’s worth… How about PHP?

PHP. Survey says… [fail sound] No.

Nooooo…!

Okay, now it’s time for the other team to steal.

Memory management.

Nick’s team - y’all have one guess. Go ahead.

What do you think about memory management?

Nah… How many answers are left? Two or one?

[00:24:07.04] Just one. The number three answer is the only one left.

Oh, okay.

Memory management, yeah…

Nah…

Things that you have to learn…

I would say Java… No, seriously.

I thought you said JavaScript, and I was like “Huh…!” [laughter]

That would be a good answer.

I don’t know, maybe some statically-typed language. I would say if we can broaden that to a statically-typed language of some kind.

I’m good with that.

Are you good? Okay.

So Java? Or any statically-typed language?

Or Java.

It’s so broad…

We can go with any. It’s broader.

Well, broader…

I guess I don’t know why I’m drilling down, because they’re both wrong. [fail sound] [laughter]

Oh, Jerod…! You set us off so well… [laughter]

So the number three answer - and this does not bode well for our industry…

If they say CSS, I swear–

People learn, but never use it in practice - testing/TDD.

Really?! [unintelligible 00:25:00.27]

Shame on all of you. Shame.

Write some tests, y’all. Write some tests.

I was gonna say that, but I think Kent C. Dodds would have just curled over…

Ten people answered this… We should probably unleash him on these people. So a few other answers - Haskell, ERD diagrams, Big O notation, “my entire CS degree”, which was kind of… [laughter] And then the real curious one, deodorant.

What?! [laughter]

Whoever submitted that, I love them.

So team Emma is now on the board. It’s 33 to 81. They’re right back in it, and we now go on to round–

Oh, Emma’s like, “Back from the dead.”

…four!

Boooooleans…!

Back from the dead, and we’re back to Emma and Nick. Step right up. Name something developers put on their website.

Buzz.

Nick got it first.

That’s not true. I’m in Sweden, I have a lag on my connection. [laughter]

Just because you’re louder doesn’t mean you’re first. Nick squeezed it in there.

I’m trying to be loud… [laughter]

Go ahead, Nick.

Something they put on their website… I’m gonna say their resume.

Their resume… [fail sound]

Really?!

Oh…! That’s pretty good.

Oh, I guess not.

There’s five answers on the board… Emma, it’s back to you. Go ahead.

Hm… I guess I’m gonna go safe, just to hopefully steal the board… I’m gonna go with contact information.

That one I will give to you. [win sound] Contact form, or how to contact me, yes.

Yaay!

So that is the number three answer. But since Nick missed altogether…

I didn’t think it would be number one, yeah…

…you are on the board, and you can play or pass.

Oh, we’re playing.

Okay. So we now go to Neil. Name something developers put on their website.

A link to their GitHub.

A link to their GitHub. Survey says… [win sound] Number one answer.

Yeah!

Nice…

So that’s what I was gonna say, but I wasn’t sure if people said the portfolio was their GitHub, or if it was not.

Yeah, that’s a good point.

The answers in this were GitHub, or social links… Anybody that says links to Twitter and social sites was all that one big thing. That’s the number one answer with 33. So we still have two, four and five available, and we are now to Divya.

Interesting. Hm… I’m thinking copyright information.

Is copyright information–

But I don’t know if that’s too– [laughter]

Wait a second, was that your answer? Or did you just read my face and try to change it?

No, it’s not. I just thought I’d think out loud, you know…

Oh, okay.

You know, like whiteboarding, kind of thing…

Right, right, right… I feel like you’re reading my face and then you just change it as I begin to [unintelligible 00:27:40.23]

No, no, no. I was thinking out loud. Also, your face has told us nothing so far…

Oh, good.

You’ve led us on many times to believe we were on the right track… [laughter] So I believe nothing.

Okay, good. I feel like I’m doing my job then.

[laughs]

So…

What do they have on their websites? Probably a blog.

Show me blog… [win sound] Yup, number five answer - blog, or blog posts, with five responses.

The copyright thing - I’ve seen it in many places, they’ve written like “2019 Copyright”, whatever… I don’t know.

Oh, for sure.

[00:28:12.04] Maybe I just follow people with that.

Well, we have two answers left, and we are back to Emma.

Alright, I’m torn between two, but I think I will go for “information about themselves.” Like an About section.

An About section. Survey says…

You mean a bio?

Yes! Thank you.

[fail sound]

I would have said bio, yeah.

I would have said bio, too.

It did not make the cut…

Where are these personal websites without bios? Who are these people?

I guess they assume they just know you. They’re like, “You should know…” [laughter]

You’re talking about our listeners here. Remember, JS Party listeners filled this out, so…

Yeah, I was gonna say… Yeah, this is amazing. Okay.

Remember that it doesn’t mean their website doesn’t have a bio; it’s like, what’s the first thing they think of when we ask them this question. You ask them the question, they answer… So it’s like what they think of.

Oh, I see, I see. Okay, what they think of.

So Neil - there’s one strike, you’ve got two strikes left, and you have two answers on the board.

I’m gonna say a photo of them.

A photo. Survey says… [fail sound]

That was my other answer.

That’s a good guess…

I would have said that, yeah. It’s a good answer.

It’s definitely–

You should have a photo on your website, people…

I think we need to stop thinking about portfolios as being a separate website.

Yeah, I think it might be just the same, included… I don’t know.

Okay, we are on to Divya… You had two strikes, so this will be your last guess, unless you get one correct.

Oh, my god… The pressure…

Copyright?

Copyright?

Yeah, I’m just gonna say copyright… [laughter] I don’t even know at this point what people – I mean, I don’t have a lot of information on mine.

Are you gonna say copyright?

I’ll go with that, why not… I don’t care.

[fail sound]

It’s the hopeless answer.

That’s why [unintelligible 00:29:46.16]

[unintelligible 00:29:48.08] that you don’t care, but also, you’re so legally correct, and I love it… [laughter]

Yeah, I am. Everything’s legally biding, you know…

Yeah, legally binding… [laughter]

I stand my ground. [laughs]

Okay… Can the Whiteboard Millionaires steal? You have a chance to steal.

Whiteboard Millionaires, I love it. I feel like we’re kind of losing some steam…

Yeah…

Normally, I think my answer would be a link to my OnlyFans page… [laughter] But this is a family-friendly show, so I won’t say that… But team, what do you think about saying projects? A link to projects.

Yes, yes. I was gonna say that.

Final answer?

Let’s do it.

Projects.

Survey says… [win sound]

Yeah…!

Number two answer.

Oh, I guess the portfolio one was right…

Actually, my portfolio is just the copyright.

Good job!

[laughs]

Do you see my shoulders from carrying so much of the weight of the team on the shoulders?

Oh, wow, wow… Okay… Okay…

Hopefully, you’re not the one who forgot how to use deodorant, so.. [laughter]

It was also me. I filled out some of these answers, you should know that.

Okay… So after four rounds, team Emma has 33, and team Nick has 138, so it might be out of reach… But we are now gonna introduce a new round, which we call the Inverted Round. I learned about this from listener Alexy, who wrote in after our last Frontend Feud and said in Russia they have the same guy, although it’s called 100 to 1 there… And they have this special round called the Inverted Round. There’s no battle, but each team gets one response. The team who gets the lowest points gets to go first, which is team Emma.

What you’re trying to do is name something on the board, but you wanna hit the bottom of the board, not the top. So the bottom is worth more points than the top.

Oh, that’s so cool, actually…

Yeah.

It’s making you flex your brain in a different way.

That’s right. So there are four answers on the board, and you’re shooting for the bottom.

It shouldn’t be hard for us… [laughter]

Name a web protocol that you’re very familiar with. Now, remember, you’re trying to find not the obvious answer, but the less obvious answers. There’s four of them on the board, and we go to team Emma first.

Okay, so let’s think about the obvious ones. The obvious ones are probably–

HTTP…

[00:32:03.18] Yeah, and TCP/IP probably… What other ones are there?

Are we talking about HTTP protocols, or…

Here’s the exact–

Well, stop helping them.

I was curious. Okay… [laughter]

It says “Name a web protocol that you’re very familiar with.” That’s what it said. So they can interpret that however they want.

That you ARE very familiar with.

That’s right.

So it’s something that people generally aren’t familiar with…

No, are.

Not necessarily… It’s gonna be the fourth answer of the things that people are familiar with…

Yeah.

Correct.

Yeah, but look at the answers we’ve gotten thus far on this show. We have someone who doesn’t use deodorant, someone who cries on Zoom, so… I mean…

[laughs] Two people cry on Zoom.

All these are – you’re just describing Emma, yeah.

But I think we’re just doing the top four, right?

That’s right, top four. You have to get in the top four, but you wanna aim for the bottom.

Yeah, we have to start from the bottom.

That’s right.

Started from the bottom now we’re here…

I don’t know.

So team Emma, please…

Those are the only two ones I know.

You can have HTTPS maybe…

What was the second one? Yeah, HTTP, I guess…

No, but I think TCP/IP is less known for web devs maybe… I don’t know.

Yeah, that’s probably fair…

Let’s just go with that one.

WebSocket…? What about WebSocket?

I was thinking sockets, too. Sockets will be pretty low on the list as well.

Alright, let’s do that, sure.

What is your answer?

Neil?

WebSockets.

WebSockets. Is WebSockets on the board? [win sound] It sure is, and it’s the number three answer, which means it’s the number two answer…

Woo-hoo!

Okay, that’s pretty nice!

…which means it’s worth 30 points. That’s a very good answer. So you now have 63…

Still not caught up.

No, not caught up. Nick, Jem and Amal… Name a web protocol that you’re very familiar with; remember, you’re trying to hit the more obscure answer.

Should we go with secure WebSockets?

Well, I’ll let you all go, and then I’ll say what I – and we’ll see if we agree.

Okay. What did you say there, Nick? Secure WebSockets?

I was joking, but yes… [laughter]

It’s more obscure, right?

I would say HTTPS…

That’s a good one, but I think it’s up here…

Yeah…

Can I hazard a guess? Can I say UDP? Yeah, yeah… [unintelligible 00:34:13.23] But I’m also open to HTTPs, because I think people don’t know about it.

Did the other team do TCP already?

No, they did WebSockets.

Okay. I would say that – yeah, I feel like I’m a little bit confused about this question though, because… You know, does this include HTTP protocols like GET, REST, POST, HEAD, whatever? Or is this – you can’t tell me right?

The thing is that it’s however the reader interpreted the survey question. The way they interpret it, they answer it the way they read it, so…

Yeah… I would almost say – yeah, I’d wanna put like maybe DELETE, or I don’t know… Like deletions, or something people don’t do…

OPTIONS…

Yeah. CORS… CORS flight is something also people don’t do a lot… But I don’t know.

Alright, Nick, you’re team captain. You have to make the final call on this one. You have JEM’s advice, he said UDP, Amal threw out a few things…

Jem’s been like–

He’s been on fire.

He’s been on fire, so let’s go with that.

Yeah, let’s do it.

But I’m changing my answer; I like TCP/IP. I think it’s a well-known web protocol, but I doubt people are familiar with it.

But actually, that would be higher, so let’s go lower. So I’ll stick with UDP.

Let’s deal with the [unintelligible 00:35:32.10]

Final answer is UDP. Survey says… [fail sound] No. It did not even make the board. So the four answers… Number one, which ends up having the least amount of points, overwhelmingly, was HTTP, with 83 of the 112 who answered. Number two was WebSockets, which you guys got correct; that was worth 30 points. DNS was number three… And the lowest one, which is the highest one in points, is REST.

That’s so weird…

Really?! So weird…!

Amal, you were in that direction.

Well, I was, but that’s okay… You don’t have to listen to me, Jem… [laughs]

[00:36:14.26] I assumed REST would be the most prominent answer…

Yeah, exactly. I thought it’d be way higher than HTTP…

I bet devs are not familiar with–

So Jem came in here with one rival, and left with five…

But REST - it’s like a pattern.

Yeah, but people are familiar with GraphQL, and that’s really popular… And GraphQL is essentially always talked about with reference to REST…

Yeah, I know… But I meant it like – I thought it was more about actual web protocols… Like standard stuff.

I see, I see.

Right. You may have thought more deeply about the question than a lot of people taking the survey… [laughter] Remember, the survey have 25 questions and people are kind of cruising through them, so probably the first thing that comes to their head, “Bam, bam, bam!”

Right, right.

Anyways, Alexy, thanks for writing in about that one. That’s cool, the Inverted Round. We’ll keep that around. And after all rounds, the winning team – the game is not over, but the winning team is Nick, with 138, the Whiteboard… It turns out they’re millionaires after all… And the Boooooleans pulled up a zero, I guess, because they have 63 points - you know, false…

63….

That’s not funny. We had points.

Not funny. [laughter]

You had points, and lost them.

[unintelligible 00:37:22.22]

You can take your points with you.

Boooooleans also mean true, so it could be…

That’s why I was trying to say false, like you lost… Anyways, it was dumb.

No, I don’t like that.

It wasn’t funny.

No.

It looks like I’m the common denominator…

I thought it was funny, Jerod… I thought it was funny.

Not false.

True Losers could be another name, you know…?

This is where I need to be more like Nick, and say my jokes quieter, so that people don’t get them.

True Losers… [laughter]

Break

[00:37:47.01]

We now go to the final round. This is Fast Money Round. The way this round works is just the winning team - that’s Nick, Jem and Amal - you pick two participants to do Fast Money. The way Fast Money Works is one of you goes in a cone of silence, the other one participates. I have five questions. You just try to hit the number one answer on each one. So it’s a rapid-fire.

I’ll say the question, the first thing that comes to your head; I’ll say the next question, first thing that comes to your head. All the way down. And then we bring the person out of the cone of silence, they then get to go, and we add up your points total. If you get over 100, then you win Fast Money, which also equals zero, or false, because there’s no money here; it’s just all for bragging rights… But it’s fun.

So Nick, who should be playing Fast Money Round for your team?

Does anyone not want to play?

I mean, I think it should be our star man…

I think the guest is an obvious choice there, since he’s been carrying the weight…

I think I should sit this out, because –

Oh, no, no, no. No.

If we win based on my answers, and then of course we’re gonna win again if I go… [laughter]

But there’s nothing else to win…

Yeah, just more wins.

It’s just more bragging rights, you know?

They’ll just hear about it for the next year…

You’ll be tired of our winning.

I will follow on the internet and be like “Remember that time when I carried you?”

[laughs]

So you don’t want that from me.

Alright, Nick, you decide. Who’s gonna play, and who’s gonna sit?

Make Jem play.

I think it should be Nick…

Nick decides.

Nick and Amal.

No, no, no… I think it should be Nick, because –

Well, it’s two of us, right?

Oh, there’s two people?

Two people play, one person sits.

[00:40:22.17] Okay, fine. Then both of us. Yeah, that’s fine.

They’re gonna do so well, since they don’t know the rules… It’s gonna be great. [laughter]

You know, I feel like that was a backwards compliment… [laughter] You know what? Thanks! I don’t follow rules. Yes, yes…

Okay, you’re gonna go second. So I’m gonna have you mute your microphone, and look into – just open up Slack. Yeah, look into my eyes – no, mute yourself; you can’t listen, and you can’t look. But just open your Slack DM with me. I’m gonna DM you when you’re ready to come back, okay?

Oh, okay.

So you have to have complete silence.

So you mean like mute, and then you want me to not hear you at all?

Yeah, take off your headset, or whatever you have to do…

Okay, yeah, I can take off my headset.

Oh, she’s gone.

Sorry, I can take off my headset.

Okay. And also mute your microphone, in case you’re just like singing a song, or humming along, or whatever you do over there… [laughter]

I’m gonna mute my [unintelligible 00:41:14.03]

Can we not put her in a breakout room sponsored by Zoom? [laughter] That great feature that Zoom has, breakout rooms…

I’m actually surprised no one mentioned the breakout room. That is a good one.

That is a good Zoom feature, especially if you upgrade for just $15,99 a month. [laughter] Okay. Price and participation may vary. Um, alright…

Alright, so I’m going first?

Yeah. Are you ready?

Okay. Name a platform for learning frontend development.

Egghead.

Name something you might find in a commit message.

Name something you associate with Silicon Valley.

Money.

Name a way to determine if code is bad.

Linting.

Okay. Name something that frontend developers might swap.

Editor configs.

That was solid.

That was good, Nick.

Good job, Nick.

Yeah, that was really good.

Way to be a captain. So proud of you.

Let me send Amal a DM to get her back…

Break

[00:42:19.16]

I am back!

Okay! We were nervous.

Oh my god, I’m so scared… I don’t know what did I–

Now, because Nick has gone first, you might have a duplicate answer, okay?

Oh, no…

So if you answer the same thing he answered, you’ll hear this sound, and you’ll have extra time to name another one. Okay?

Okay, okay.

Now, I’m gonna ask you five things, and it’s just the first thing that comes to your head.

Name a platform for learning frontend development.

Oh, Frontend Masters.

Name something you might find in a commit message.

[fail sound]

Um… Fix.

Name something you associate with Silicon Valley.

Douchebags. I’m just kidding… [laughter] Bros… Um, sorry. [laughter] Let’s see…

Just go with bros. It was good.

How about douchebros? Just kidding. [laughter] No, VCs.

Oh, god…

VCs… Okay. Name a way to determine if code is bad.

Large, large functions.

Okay. Name something that frontend developers might swap.

Really? This can of worms? Um, frameworks…

Okay. Very good. How do you all feel like they did?

Really good.

This was solid.

It’s so funny, because the Silicon Valley - I had the same impulse reaction.

I did too, actually…

Bros was such a good answer…

That one’s definitely on the board, but…

Amal was just throwing out everything she felt… All the feelings towards Silicon Valley.

That’s right.

As the only person here in Silicon Valley, that hurts… You know?

[00:44:02.07] Sorry…

I mean…

I’m always sort of a bro… Like, half a bro. [laughter]

Well, let’s add up your scores and see if you guys won even more winning… Name a platform for learning frontend development - Nick said Egghead; that is the number three answer, worth 14 points. And Amal said Frontend Masters; that is the number five answer, that’s worth eight points. So you did very well. You did not hit number one…

Free Code Camp - was that number one?

Free Code Camp was number two at 15, and Udemy was number one, at 16.

Really…?

Why. I like Udemy. [laughter]

Well, you said frontend code, so I was like “Oh yeah, Frontend Masters.” I’m at the point where I don’t really use those tools as much…

No, you did really well.

That was pretty good, yeah.

That was a good guess. That was the number five answer. Okay, so name something you might find in a commit message. You guys did very well on this one - WIP was Nick’s answer; that’s number four, with eight points… And of course, Amal, you also tried to answer that way, so you’re honing in together, you’re on the same wavelength… And then you said Fix, which is the number one answer, with 21 points.

Nice! Nice.

I was gonna say SHA-1, and then I realized that’s not part of a message, hopefully… [laughs]

Not the message… Unless you read – I just read the SHAs now.

I was gonna say swear, if I had to choose…

I would have said a profanity.

Swearing was in there. That’s the number seven answer. Also, “Oops!”, ticket number reference…

Oops, I did it again… [laughter]

“Fixed it for real this time”, that was another one…

…like Britney Spears…

I love that one.

I have messages like that, yeah.

Name something that you associate with Silicon Valley… Nick said money; that’s the number two answer, worth 12 points. Amal said VCs… That one didn’t actually even make the list. It was mentioned, but only a couple times. Number one was “high cost of living”, with 18. Money again, with 12. The show - when they think of Silicon Valley, they think of the show; worth eight. Income inequality was number four…

Wow, that got real deep, yeah.

Startups was number five…

They’re woke. Some woke responses… Really woke.

And number six was tech bros, jerks. So you could have went with that answer…

Wait, hold on–

We almost got it!

But you kept talking and changed it.

I think we should give it to her, because she was trying to make this family-friendly.

It’s true, yeah.

Even though she said douche about five times.

We’re gonna have a lot of bleeps on this episode.

You mean six times now? [laughter]

We’re gonna have to bleep out OnlyFans as well… And again, because I just said it again.

How am I gonna make money? You know, I’ve got a family to feed… Come on, Jerod. [laughter]

“Name a way to determine if code is bad”, and Nick said linting. That was the number six answer, with eight votes. And Amal said large functions - that’s lost into the number three answer, which was kind of like verbosity, duplication, long function…

Yeah, verbosity.

What about nesting?

Where does testing score on this? [laughs]

So the number one answer was code smells, which is kind of a–

Arrggh…!

I mean, long functions are a code smell.

Right. It’s a subtype. Yeah, I know.

Yeah. But anyways…

Number two was “Read it”, or “See if it’s readable”, which again, smells and readability… Verbosity was three. Tests was number four; or not tests, or bad tests. Number five was “Run it” or “Execute it”, or “Does it work?” Six was linter, like we said, and then seven was inconsistencies.

“Does it work on your machine…?” [laughter]

“It works on mine…”

“Because it works on mine…” Exactly. [laughs]

That’s something you should have in commit messages, “It works on my machine…” [laughter] Name something that frontenders might swap… Nick said configs. That one was not on the list at all. Amal said frameworks. That was the number two answer, so that gave you 10 points.

How do you swap a framework?

The number one answer there was stickers. Frontenders swap stickers.

Oh… Physically swapping.

What’s interesting is this one was interpreted both ways.

I was thinking spit, but…

Yeah…

That was an answer.

Wait, what?! Like S-P-I-T? [laughter]

[00:47:58.18] Yeah, like they swap spit.

Yeah, just because that’s a phrase. Like, swapping spit. I don’t know.

Right.

I have never heard this phrase. [unintelligible 00:48:02.29]

Yeah, developers are notorious for their–

What is this phrase…?!

I’m single in a foreign country, what do you want from me? [laughter]

Emma also answered she’s coding in bed; it was Emma’s last Frontend Feud answer.

Oh, really? Coding in bed… [laughter]

I’m [unintelligible 00:48:17.00]

So stickers was number one, frameworks was number two… Moving on. CSS classes… Now, see, here they’re swapping classes, so that’s more like a technical term. Stories, horror stories, war stories etc. They swap code…

War stories?

That’s what they said, war stories. Swap code, or snippets, that kind of stuff… And then the last one was–

Is stylesheets on there?

…links and social handles. You know, like “Hey, give me your social handle. Let’s swap links.” Link swap.

The classic developer catchphrase.

Yeah, yeah.

So adding it up, the Money Round here… The two of you together scored 104 points.

That’s more than a hundred, which was your goal.

Nice.

So you guys win again. Congratulations!

Finally, Jem can stop complaining about carrying the team… [laughter]

I mean, did I get us here? Yes. Did I massively offload the burden to the two people I delegated…?

I like that you’re giving an inspirational speech to this applause. [laughter]

Exactly. I like to think all the people who didn’t help me - that’d be Emma, Neil and Divya - you all didn’t help me at all…

We gave you moral support.

That’s true, I felt it. [00:49:28.00] I believed in you from the beginning, as you can tell. And you won…

Yeah. Thanks.

…which is what’s really important out of all this.

I know.

And you beat Emma, which is really what’s most important out of all of this.

We did. We did. Thank you for letting us try and master Jem, you know…

[laughter]

Now I’ve been on the winning team both times, so…

That’s true, Nick. The silent assassin.

Such humble teammates I have…

Well, that is our show… Thanks for playing frontend feud with us. If this is your first time listening or watching JS Party, definitely subscribe and come hang out. We record live on Thursdays. You can hang out in our chat, and participate. We love having a fun time while we record, so please do that. Check us out at JSParty.fm if you haven’t yet.

Thanks to our special guests this week, Jem and Neil - we appreciate you joining us - and to all of our regular panelists… Emma, Nick, Amal and Divya. Thanks for playing. That’s Frontend Feud, and we’ll talk to you next time.

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