JS Party – Episode #264

Frontend Feud: CSS Podcast vs @keyframers

with Una & Adam vs David & Shaw

All Episodes

Una & Adam from The CSS Podcast defend their Frontend Feud title against challengers David & Shaw from the keyframers. Let’s get it on!



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Notes & Links

📝 Edit Notes


1 00:06 Sponsor: Sentry 01:49
2 01:55 It's feud time, y'all! 00:46
3 02:42 Welcoming our contestants 01:00
4 03:42 Larry the intern's interview questions 00:56
5 04:38 How the game works 01:29
6 06:07 Round 1: Future JS runtime 06:59
7 13:07 Round 2: Big tech job 06:14
8 19:35 Sponsor: Lolo Code 01:56
9 21:31 Round 3: Coding monitors 03:29
10 25:01 Round 4: Can't code without 08:58
11 33:58 Round 5: Primary web browser 03:07
12 37:28 Sponsor: KBall Coaching 01:05
13 38:45 Round 6: Why write software 06:31
14 45:15 End Game 01:38
15 46:54 Interviewing the champs 01:46
16 48:40 Wrapping up (merch!) 00:58
17 49:47 Outro (more dev game shows!) 01:17


📝 Edit Transcript


Play the audio to listen along while you enjoy the transcript. 🎧

Welcome, friends. This is Frontend Feud, everyone’s favorite award-worthy game show, made by the award-winning JS Party Podcast that you’re listening to this very moment. I’m Jerod Santo, and I’d like to thank all 100 of our savvy, tasteful, good-looking audience members for taking the time to take the survey which makes this game possible.

After dethroning the Shop Talk guys last time we played, Una Kravets and Adam Argyle are back from the CSS Podcast, defending their title. Welcome to the show!

Thank you.

Let’s see if we can go two for two.

We shall see, we shall see. And our challengers - we have David and Shaw from The Keyframers show. Welcome, guys.

Hey, thanks for having us.

Thanks for having us. Ah, jinx.

Jinx. [laughter]

They’re already on the same page. This is a problem, Adam. [laughter]

That may not work if we’re trying to sync up on what the audience is thinking though…

That’s true. Now, I’ve been told that it’s customary in game shows to take a moment and get to know each of our contestants… But I didn’t really have time to prep for this, so I asked our intern Larry to do some research and write up a question, one for each of you, which I’ll read now.

So Una, do you remember the first time you rode a bike without training wheels?

Hah… I do remember.

Alright, thank you. Adam. [laughter] Who is your daddy, and what does he do?

“I’m a cop, you idiot!” [laughter]

David, I’m told you play the piano?

Where do you think Elton John gets those fancy outfits he wears on stage?

Oh, I don’t know… He probably coordinates with Billy Joel. I have no idea.

Good answer. Shaw, do you like apples?

Yeah… Yeah, they’re pretty good.

Well, I got her number. How do you like the – Larry, that’s terrible. That’s not even a question. [laughter] Gosh… Let’s just move on, let’s move on to our game, which as you know, is not a game about how much frontend or JavaScript or developer information you all have in your heads, it’s how well you know the life of a developer, the choices, the answers that our listening audience put into those textboxes on the survey.

So here’s how it works… We have six rounds, of course, two teams, each round has a gameboard in which we have a statement, followed by the top-matching answers, highest to lowest. Your job is to match the highest-ranking answers, accumulate points, and the team with the most points at the end of six rounds wins.

Now, each round starts with what we call an interface-off, because we love puns, in which one person from each team steps up and gets to guess first. The person who matches the highest-ranking answer on the board during that time gets to take the round, and their team plays that entire round until three strikes occur, at which point the other team can steal the points in the round with one guess.

Now, there’s no conferring between you and your teammate during the regular round, but during the steal y’all can talk, decide, and figure out which steal you’re gonna play. Any questions?

When does Steve Harvey get here? [laughter]

[06:01] You’re looking at him. I’m your Steve Harvey today. I apologize in advance… This is as good as it’s going to get. Alright, first up in our interface-off, it is David vs. Una. Step right up.



Alright, ladies first… Una, we asked 100 JS Party listeners “Which server-side JavaScript runtime do they expect to be using three years from now?” What do you suppose was their response?

Hmm, a runtime… So is this like Node.js? Because that’s been pretty popular for a long time, and likely will continue.

Is that your answer?

Yes, that’s my final answer…

Final answer?

Final answer…

Survey says… [win alert] That is the number one answer.


So 43 of 100 said they will be using Node three years from now. So that means David does not get a chance; I apologize, but Una stole the board… And now Team CSS Podcast gets to play. There are four total answers on the board; you’ve got the number one answer, and you now need to find the other three.

I shall say, in order to make it on the board, an answer must have at least five responses. So you may match something that somebody said, but we had to have five people say it for it to make the board. So, CSS Podcast is live…

This is a hard one… [laughs]

It’s Adam’s turn. There’s three left; you already have Node. Which server-side JS runtime do people expect to be using three years from now?”

The one I just built my site on top of - Deno.

Show me Deno. [win alert] It is on there. Let’s find out where it is.

You can’t just rearrange letters… It’s cheating.

In fact, number two! 30 respondents said they’d be using Deno three years from now. Very good.

I’ve got another one. Is this on Una, or –

Yeah, it goes back to her now, so you’ll have another chance…

It goes back to me.

Yeah, it toggles back and forth till we get three strikes. You’re halfway there, but there are two responses left. What do you think, Una?

God, I don’t know… Server-side runtime. I don’t even know if this is server-side runtime, but I know that there is a tool that’s been growing in popularity, which has server-side rendering; I just don’t know if this is a runtime, or accounts – because it’s a server. But this is what runs a server, right?

Remember that the answers for the survey were completely based on the interpretation of the question by the survey takers. So they can take it however they want. I can’t clarify what I meant, because it meant something different to everybody. So go ahead and guess, and see what you can do.

God, this is gonna be wrong… This is gonna be wrong, but for some reason – I’m thinking Vite. But that’s not a server-side runtime. But anyway…

Show me Vite… [fail alert] I’m sorry, but yes, that is incorrect. So you now have one strike against you, and we go back to Adam.

I’ll say Bun. Show me some Buns.

Show us Buns. [win alert] Bun is on the list, number four, with seven responses. So now we have Node at number one, Deno at number two, number three is a question mark, and Bun with seven. You have one strike, so two more wrong guesses before a steal. Una, we’re back to you.

Okay, so I’m thinking with things like Node being very popular, maybe people are thinking along those lines, so maybe people are thinking of like – everything I’m thinking of is a framework on top of a runtime, that’s the problem… This is a hard one. Dang, my next thought goes like “Oh, what if it’s something like Express, if they’re thinking about Node but they’re not sure what the right answer is here?” But that’s not a runtime, it’s a framework that you use on top of Node. Can I phone a friend? [laughs]

We will need some sort of a guess…

Different show.

That’s a different show. We do not have that kind of budget around here.

What about Adam? Adam is my friend…

[10:07] Well, you can get one wrong and it’ll be back to him. He gets another chance. So you can just guess whatever you like… Remember, it’s what they said, it’s not what is correct.

That’s true… I’ll guess Express, but I just know that’s probably not it. Unless it is…

Show me Express… [fail alert]


It is not Express. I will say that there was at least one response that was Express… So you were not completely wrong… But not five.

No, I was wrong. I knew that I was wrong.

I was trying to throw you a bone. Two strikes… Back to Adam. Okay, this is it. You’ve got one on the board… What do you think people said to this question about JS runtimes three years from now?

Yeah, so I’m just gonna go with the first one that I wrote down; I’m not sure if it’s totally it, but… And maybe there’s multiple terms, but it’s either Cloudflare Workers or Edge Workers in general. So just running your servers at the edge, in a serverless function.

Okay, show us Edge Workers. [fail alert] I’m sorry, that is also not on the board. We now have an opportunity to steal. There’s 80 points up for grabs… So Keyframers guys, if you steal this, you get the 80, plus the correct answer. If you don’t, the 80 goes to Una and Adam and we move on.

Oh, gosh…

So you get one guess. You can discuss together…

Fingers crossed.

…that number three slot - what is it? What is it?

What are you thinking, David?

I mean, I was also thinking Cloudflare Workers… But there has to be something else obvious that we’re not thinking of.

WebAssembly is the only thing that’s coming to mind for me…

You know what - yeah. I think that’s a – let’s go for it. That’s a good guess.

WebAssembly, final answer.

For the steal, WebAssembly. [fail alert] I’m sorry, but it was not WebAssembly… Which means CSS Podcast is awarded 80 points.

See, this is the luck aspect…

And we will now see what is that magical number three.

It’s not io.js, right?

Is it Bazel, or something?

One thing you have to know about JS Party listeners is they love to reject the premise of the question. The answer is none. They do not see themselves using a JS runtime.

I was trying to answer with the rejection of the premise as well… [laughs]

What if they just misspelled Node?

Ooh, also a possibility… Eight people misspelled Node…

They’re just a few keyboard clicks away…

Didn’t one just show up though after Bun? Like, Bun got their funding, and I thought somebody else showed up recently, that’s like another fast – and I couldn’t remember what it was, but maybe I’m confusing it with…

What about browser-based JS runtimes?

No, it didn’t make the list. A few other runners-up - so three people said Remix, two said Astro, one person said Ruby on Rails…

Yeah, but those are frameworks…

This is the same problem… Not runtimes…

It’s the same problem. And one person said “An unreleased Go framework”, which I think they’re gonna be releasing, or something… But that’s what they’re gonna be using three years from now.

You heard it here first.

So you heard it here first. Alright, that brings us to round two… So after the first round, CSS Podcast holds on to their 80 points. We now move to round two, and our interface-off is between Shaw and Adam. Step right up.

Ooh… Brothers from another mother.

Let’s go.

Alright, we’ll let Shaw go first on this one… The question is “Every big tech company wants to hire you. Compensation is identical. Which do you choose?” There are five answers on the board. Shaw, we go to you.

Man, that’s tough. What does the audience think, is the question… I’m gonna go with Apple.

Show us Apple. [win alert] You are correct, and it is the number one answer, with 21 respondents choosing Apple, which means, Keyframers, you get to play this round, and we go to David for Another guess.

[14:04] Awesome. Well, running through the FAANG, MANGA, whatever we wanna call it, I would say another one would be - I just came from Microsoft, so… I don’t know if that’s the obvious one though. Oh, oh, um – man, is OpenAI a big…? You know what - let’s go with the obvious first. Microsoft.

Show us Microsoft. [win alert] Number two answer, with 18. Very nice. Back to you, Shaw. We are now rolling in round two.

I’m gonna say Google is definitely on there.

Show us Google. [win alert] Number three answer. 13 points to you, sir. Very well played.

Going down the list.

Do we get extra points for going in order…?

You get kudos from me. You have the top three. Four and five - of course, it gets more difficult as you get further down, because there’s lots of big tech companies to guess from. David, what are you thinking?

I was gonna say Amazon, but that’s like – the only reason you would work there is for the compensation, no offence… But if it’s identical, then – you know what, let’s do Netflix. That’s a big one.

Show us Netflix. [win alert] Number five answer. Very good. So you lost your purity in order, but you did not lose your purity in guesses. So your four for four. There’s one left. Number four is still open. Zero strikes against you. So you have three guesses at this before a steal.

Man, I wouldn’t want to work there, but Meta/Facebook is probably on the list somewhere… Mostly because of their React development. I’m sure people wanna be a part of…

Show us Meta… [fail alert] Strike number one. Not in the top five. David, back to you.

Good on you, audience. [laughter]

Alright, let’s go with the obvious… Amazon.

Show me Amazon. [fail alert] Amazon had three, but didn’t quite make the top five.

Now we have two strikes and we’re down to our last guess. Una and Adam, start thinking about a steal.

Okay, what else is in the acronym…? Man, I’m not even thinking of any other top companies…

Am I allowed to help, or…? If we’re on the same team.

Not at this point. During a steal, you can help.

Yeah, so it’s not Amazon, it’s not Meta… And GitHub’s a part of Microsoft, so that – did you combine audience answers into…?

Yes. GitHub is Microsoft, yes.

Okay. Geez… Let’s go with OpenAI. I’m sure there’s some interest out there.

OpenAI - is it in that number four slot? Survey says… [fail alert] No, it is not. I’m sorry, but you did not clear the board, and so now we have an opportunity to steal from CSS Podcast… And you guys can discuss, so what are you thinking?

I’m thinking that this is a benefits-based answer probably. That’s kind of where my head’s at.

I’m thinking about where everybody just left these big companies… Where did they all go? What was the number one spot, if you did work at Apple, Microsoft, Google - where did you bounce? Who stole everyone recently?

Apple fired no one…

Apple fired no one. I think that’s why they’re on top, honestly.

Yeah, that might be…

But I think Shopify…

You know, that’s a good idea. What do you think of Spotify?

That was also on my list… And the other one on my list here is Vercel, because they’re so hot right now. Everybody’s probably gonna wanna work there; and if compensation’s good…

But I wouldn’t call that a big tech company… So this is hard. This is hard, because you only get one answer… I know a lot of great people that went to Shopify.

I only know a couple that went to Spotify…

…but I can’t say that they’re doing better now than they were a year ago. I mean, nobody is… [laughter] Not the people, the company. Spotify has those sweet, sweet, benefits, just like Netflix. I think that people are thinking about the benefits with the Netflix answer, too.

Yeah. Shopify was all stock, right? Because they’re like the eCommerce backbone.

Well, we’re running out of time here. You’re gonna have to confer and pick one of these.

Alright, Adam, you pick.

[18:05] I’m gonna say Shopify based on the stats of who went where… I don’t know.

Okay. For the steal and 61 additional points to add to your score - is Shopify number four? [fail alert] It is not… So we will award the 61 points to the Keyframers…

It’s gonna be none… [laughter]

Actually, I wrote “myself” on my thing; I should have remembered that.

And I will say that you guys did not learn from last round… Of course, 12 people said “None.” Should have seen that one coming, but it’s difficult. So three people said Amazon, three people said Vercel, three said Spotify, three said Netflix, two said Cloudflare, one said Adobe, presumably after they heard about Katy Perry’s mushroom-filled fantasy land… And one said “Anyone that lets me write Ruby”, and then one said “The one with the least crazy CEO.”

Ooh, burn…

So there’s a few runners-up…

I feel like there’s one audience member that’s really set on Ruby on Rails…

I think so… [laughs]

For real, yeah.

All the Ruby answers are coming in by one person. Alright, so after two rounds, it’s a tight game… CSS Podcast with 80, Keyframers with 61, and we move now to round three.

Now, this round is a little bit different. We call this the Inverted Round. So we’re just gonna take turns, team by team, guessing responses, but the points at the bottom of the board are higher than the points at the top. So while you’re trying to match the board, you’re actually trying to match the least popular answer to get more points.

The question that we asked our listeners - “How many monitors do you use while coding?” There are four responses on the board, and I will say the least popular response is worth the most points. So David and Shaw played the last round, let’s let Una and Adam start this round; we’re just gonna go back and forth… And let’s start with Una. Go ahead and guess what you think people said when we asked them how many monitors they use while coding.

Okay, so this is how many monitors they use, but the least popular answer.

That’s what you wanna get. They’re all worth points, so you can get the top score and get points, but you’re gonna get more points by getting the bottom score.

Well, I know how many I use, so… [laughs] I think what I wanna go with is 3. Like, if they have two monitors and a laptop, that’s gonna hurt your neck. But I know people do it. So my answer is 3.

Alright, show us 3. [win alert] Three is on the board, and it is in slot number 3. 14 people use three monitors, which means you get 15 points for that response. I’ll award those now, and now we’ll go back to Keyframers, and let’s go to Shaw. How many monitors do people use while coding?

Let’s see… If we’re going with least popular, I’m gonna say one is on there, but it’s not gonna be the top one.

Show us one… [win alert] Yes, one is on there, and it’s the number two response, so you get slightly less points. You still score ten. 35 people out of 100 use one monitor. We’ll award those points now, and go back to CSS Podcast.

I’m team one. [laughter]

And we’ll go to Adam. So one monitor is taken, three monitors is taken. Those are the two and three slots. The one and the four are still available; of course, the four is worth more than the one. What do you think?

I’m gonna go with the pattern we’ve seen… People are gonna say “None”, they’re gonna reject it. “I don’t.” So people say “I don’t”, or “None.”

No monitor coding… That’s impressive.

Just their laptop.

I’m not using a monitor right now, so that’s valid.

Yeah, I’m assuming people are gonna think of this as external monitors, because it’s impossible to – I guess it’s not impossible to code without a monitor, but… People are gonna say “None. Just whatever is built-in”, or whatever. So that’s my answer.

Bold. Very bold. Did anybody say they code with no monitors? [win alert] They sure did. One person - I made an exception to the rule - said “Zero monitors”, and they said “I am fully blind, and I do everything by touch.” So they don’t use a monitor because they can’t see.


Very cool.

So you get 20 points for that. Congratulations. And there’s the number one answer still out there. So we’ll award those, and we’ll go back to Keyframers, and we’ll go to David for the last one out there. I think you can probably infer what it is.

Yes, the number one answer –

Sixteen monitors… [laughter]

Two monitors. 50, literally half of the people are using two monitors when they code. That’s worth five points, and we’ll award those… And thus ends our inverted round. Good job Adam on – I didn’t think anybody was gonna get the zero on this one, because it’s so obscure… But there we go. Alright, let’s head to round four.

Okay, so at the beginning of round four we have Keyframers with 76, CSS Podcast with 115; it’s anybody’s game. There’s two more regular rounds, and then the last round is double points. So if you’re behind, you have a big chance of coming back in round six.

We asked 100 JS Party listeners to finish this sentence: “I couldn’t code without…” What? Without *blank*. We’ll now have an interface-off. We’re back to David and Una facing off. So Una went first the first time, and we’ll have David go first this time. David, there are six answers on the board. What couldn’t people code without? I will say, on this round and a few others, the responses vary, but kind of mean the same thing, so we’re grouping the categories. So if you hit a very specific thing that’s in a category, I’ll let you know, and we won’t count it as a guess.

[25:53] Okay. Well, I know that I can’t code without coffee. I turn coffee into code, so…

Okay, show us coffee. [win alert] It’s on the board. Where is it on the board? It’s at number four, with eleven responses. So Una does have a chance to match higher than that. What is something else that people can’t code without?

Continuing on the alliteration, I can’t code without a computer.

Without a computer. Taking a very literally –

The math checks out… [laughter]

Did our audience take it as literally as that? [win alert] They sure did. Number one answer was “hardware”, whether it was a keyboard – people said “keyboard”, they said “computer”, they said “electricity”, or “internet”.

I was thinking electricity also…

We grouped all those together, and that’s 23 people. So CSS Podcast, you are playing this round. Adam, we go to you. There’s still four slots open. What else can people not code without?

Nice, we’ve crossed off a lot of my– Does second monitor – is that in hardware? I kind of assume it would be…

Second monitor - yeah. Any sort of hardware is in there. Even no monitor is in there, I suppose.

Knowing some of your listeners, I’m gonna say TypeScript.


Show us TypeScript. [fail alert] I’m happy to announce that that is incorrect.

Yeah, I’m actually in the same boat. I don’t need TypeScript, but I thought everyone else did. [laughter]

You’ve been overwhelmed – yes, you’ve been influenced by Nick Nisi. He’s strong on the message, but no. We are out there still in force, us regular JavaScript authors. Alright, but that’s a strike, so we go back to Una. Now you’ve got one strike against you.

Alright, I’m still on this literal train… I can’t code without a text editor of some sort.

Show us text editor. [win alert] Yeah, number two answer, 22 responses. Some said “editor”, some said specific editors, like Vim, VS Code etc. We’ve put them all in one group… And that was number two. So we’re back to Adam. One strike, you’ve got half the board cleared, but there’s still half up there. What do you think?

It’s getting tricky…

You got this, Adam.

I’d say “hands”, but… Is that hardware? [laughter] And I know people can code without their hands, right? You’re just like “Nah, I don’t need hands to code. I’ll code with my voice.” Code in VR with your elbows, or something; I don’t know. I am gonna say “hands.” Fingers and hands.

That’s not grouped into hardware. I think that’s kind of wetware, or I don’t know what kind of ware that is… But is it on there? [win alert] Yes, it is!

Oh, nice!

Oh, I got lucky! Oh, man… I thought for sure I was going down…

And it’s in the general category of body parts. So this includes brains, hands, eyeballs, and other such things that you can’t code without… Or at least some people cannot. Alright, so that’s still one strike; back to Una. We’ve got two things left, three and six.

Alright, I’m thinking like people would probably something like Stack Overflow, or like a way to help them get answers… So I’m gonna say Stack Overflow. I don’t know if that’s been grouped into a larger section…

Is Stack Overflow one of the things that people cannot code without? [win alert] Yes, it is. And it’s grouped into the generic thing of Google. Stack Overflow, GitHub… Web resources.

Yeah, helpers.

Yeah. 14 people. So the board is almost cleared. You’ve got five of six. The last one is still on there… 76 points awarded so far, and one strike. You’ve got two guesses at number six. Back to Adam.

Okay, there’s some silly ones on here, but I feel like another silly one is sitting there at number six… I could go really heady, you know, like “purpose”, but I don’t think your audience people were like “I can only code with purpose…”

What are you trying to say about our audience? They don’t have purpose? [laughter]

I’m a user-centric engineer, so for me, I’d be like “I can’t code unless there’s a user, because otherwise I’m just coding into the ether”, but again, heady… I don’t think anyone else is gonna say that… It’s a very Adam thing to say…

You could be your own user…

[29:47] I could be my own user… I’m gonna go with the only other thing on my list that maybe makes sense, which is funding. Money. You have to give me stuff to do this. I’m not gonna do this for free, ish…

That’s a good answer.

Yeah. Compensation maybe? Show us compensation. [fail alert] Sorry, not on there, compensation…

I thought it was a good try.

It was a good guess… But you know, some of us just code for the love… Two strikes.

That’s true.

Una, back to you.

I lose money when I code… [laughter]

That happens as well, yeah.

Time is money. [laughs] I don’t think I have a better answer, but the place my mind went was like “What are your physical needs when you’re doing any task?” and sleep is one of them. So maybe I can’t code if I’m sleep-deprived; I need my sleep.

Hm… Show us sleep. [fail alert] I’m sorry, sleep is not on the list… But this provides opportunity to the Keyframers to get back in the game here… Lots of points to steal. We turn to you; you can discuss. It’s number six, so not very many people said it… In fact, five said it… But what do you think they said? What was that last response? Go ahead and discuss.

Shaw, one recent trend that’s been all over Twitter and the internets has been AI and ChatGPT, and I know that personally, I rely on it a good bunch to do coding. So…

Yeah, I think that’s good… I don’t know that the audience will be fully on that train…

Don’t underestimate them.

So none is a possibility here. “I couldn’t code without none.”

[laughs] That’s always a possibility… “I reject your premise, sir.”

There’s at least one response that’s Ruby on Rails… [laughter]

Yeah, for sure.

That’s true…

But a more realistic answer is probably like source control, like Git, that kind of thing… Or open source, like npm, and…

So we’ve got AI on one hand, and open source…

Where do you think our audience is going?

I feel like when asked this question – I don’t know, I’m still stuck on the ChatGPT thing. Or, sorry, Copilot. That’s what I meant.

Alright, let’s go with it.

Now, quick meta game here - what if one of you is right and the other one’s wrong? How are we gonna feel that we go with one and not the other? Is this gonna tear up the Keyframers?

Just half the points…

Could this be the end of the Keyframers as we know it? The behind-the-band, years from now…? Like, what happened was this answer on Frontend Feud. Well, let’s see what it is here. You said GitHub Copilot/AI helpers. Did our audience say that? [fail alert] I’m sorry, but they did not.

Oh, man. I’m so sorry.

But in order to keep the band together, I’ll say Shaw was also wrong… And the correct answer - well, let’s award these points here to CSS Pod…

The Terminal…

And the correct answer was “Peace, and quiet, and muting all the things…”

Space. They needed space.

So Una was in the ballpark with her physical needs. Just, sleep was a little bit outside of what they were saying. Now, there were other responses –

I guess you have peace when you’re sleeping. Come on. [laughs]

You still got the points… [laughs]

Just kidding. I thought that source control was a very good answer.

I did too, as well. Tooling, in general, you would think… Although editor is kind of on the fringe of that, but… One person said patience and stubbornness, which I thought was funny, because we asked for one thing… One person said “Wasting 50% of my time on meetings”, and so they were pretty sour… And then talk about literal - “The one thing I can’t code without are the letters C, O, D and E.” So that was a snarky response, I thought.

Okay. Wow.

Yeah, that’s what I’m saying. Thanks, guys… Alright, so thus ends round four…

I’m surprised no one said programming languages.

And there was no Ruby on Rails. So while it was a good guess, they probably got sick of answering that particular thing. After four rounds, we’ve got CSS Podcast pulling away a little bit; it’s still in play, but it’s 191 to 76. Let’s move to round five.

[34:00] Alright – oh, and it turns out… I forgot this, but round five is also inverted. So this will be just like round three, where we go back and forth. You’re trying to match the bottom of the board, and the phrase they’re matching against is “My primary web browser is ______.” Let’s start with the Keyframers this time. David.

Alright, the hot new one is Arc. I feel like there’s a couple of people who’ve answered that…

It is a great browser.

Show us Arc. [win alert] You are correct, sir, and it’s near the bottom of the list, number four. So you’re awarded 20 points for that.

Very nice answer. Now we go over to CSS Pod, Una.

I’m just gonna say Chrome.

She’s taking the easy points. Is Chrome on there? Of course it is… And it is number one. [win alert] So you get five points. Back to Keyframers, and Shaw…

Oh, I didn’t realize this was an inverted one. My bad. That was my fault… I thought it was normal, and then I – yeah…

Hey, five points is five points.

I’m gonna go with Safari. I think that’s probably towards the bottom…

Show us Safari. [win alert] Yes, it is the worst answer, which makes it the best answer! Six people, 25 points.


I’ll award those to you. The plot thickens… Adam, we’re over to you. Two and three are still on the board.

Yeah, Firefox.

Firefox is on here… [win alert] Number two, ten points awarded to you. And Keyframers - can they swipe up – what’s the word? Swoop up? Sweep up! That’s the word. Can they sweep up these last 15 points? David’s turn.

What’s in the middle…?

I mean, I have two good answers, and one of them is silly, one of them is more realistic… But considering the audience, I’m gonna say people gave the joke answer of Internet Explorer.

That’s a very interesting guess. Is it on there? [fail alert]

They took this one seriously. You had the exact wrong time to go jokey. Una.

Oh, Microsoft Edge. The other one from Microsoft.

Microsoft Edge. [fail alert] Not on the list. Back to Keyframers with Shaw.

Come on, Shaw…!

Man, the only other one on my list right now is Brave. Given the tech audience, that seems to be a go-to… Is it on there?

Show us Brave. [win alert]


Yes, it is. You’ve found it, that number three. 16 people using Brave, worth 15 points… And that concludes round five. Hey, it’s a tight game. We have Keyframers with 146, CSS Podcast with 206. There were a couple other answers… So four people said Edge. Two with Vivaldi…

That’s less than Safari. I should have won more points. [laughs]

Yeah, but it didn’t make the top. It didn’t have the requisite five…

It’s tricky…

And there’s one lonely Opera user. Hi, Opera user…

We now go to our final round, and this one has twice as many points on the board.

I love that music.

Thank you. Round six, the final round - double score. We’ll go back to our interface-off. This time it’ll be Shaw versus Adam, and please remind me who went first the first time, so I can be fair. Was it you, Shaw?

I think it was me.

Okay. Does that sound right?

I don’t know…

It was oh so long ago. [laughter] Well, let’s just assume you’re correct, and go with Adam. So the question, “What one word sums up why you make software?” And I’ll say this is another one where we end up grouping some words together, that meant very similar things… But there are six answers on the board. It’s anybody’s game. Probably whoever wins this round wins this edition of Frontend Feud. So no pressure, Adam, but you’re up.

Thank you for that no-pressure warning.

You’re welcome.

Okay, I’m just gonna say for the love… Maybe it’s in the middle, I don’t know. Love. Passion.

Show us love. [fail alert]

I’m sorry.

I’m alone in that, apparently.

That hurts. [laughter]

No love. There’s no love on this board. Shaw, that means it’s wide open for you to take the round…

Yeah, the opposite of love - money. I’m gonna say it’s on there.

Well played. Show us money. [win alert] Yeah, that one’s on there, and it is in slot number two. 15 people responded, which is worth 30 points, and you now take the board. So Keyframers will play this round. Number two is taken. One, three, four, five and six are still out there. David, what do you think?

For fun. Enjoyment. Pleasure. Fun.

Fun, enjoyment, pleasure, but notably not love…

Is fun on there? [win alert] Number one answer.

Joy, fun, enjoyment. Very good. Okay, one and two are gone. Shaw, back to you.

To solve a problem, fulfill a need.

Your second phrase kind of ruined it for me… Do I give it to them anyways? It’s close… Ah, I’ll give it to you. [win alert] Number three was puzzles, challenges, and problem-solving. To fill a need was maybe moving beyond the whole challenge of it, but I’ll give it to you.

No, you need to solve a problem. It makes sense.

Fair enough, fair enough.

Well, like, I need some piece of software to do X, Y, Z, so I write it myself.

Yeah. See, that’s further away. These people are thinking like the puzzle aspect; like, the challenge. But you got problem-solving, that’s literally in the list, so I gave it to you. You’re good to go. One, two, three, and you have four through six on the board. No strikes yet. David, you’re up.

I know a lot of people – like, besides it being a job, a lot of people just like automating stuff. So I would say for automation.

Show us automation. [fail alert] There were a couple that agreed with you, but not enough to make the board. So there’s your first strike… It’s getting pressure-filled at this point. You need three more to take the game. So, Shaw.

[41:53] Ah, geez… So it’s one word; that makes things tricky… To help? Like helping others? That’s two words, but…

[fail alert] I’m sorry, but help is not on there. Now we’re down to two strikes. We have one more guess, three on the board, so your back’s up against it… But you can still do this. David, what do you think?

Okay, so some probably make software, you could do it for a job, you could do it for money, as a puzzle… I make software to – you know what, this is sort of a silly answer, but for fame. People want to be known.

Hmm… For the fame. Do JS Party listeners want the fame? Let’s see it. [fail alert] I’m sorry, but they did not say fame.

I don’t know…

Pretty good guess… We have the steal available to you guys over there at the CSS Pod to retain your championship. You’ve got three opportunities to drill it. What are you thinking?

Oh, this is hard.

I’m so glad they said a few that were on my list…

Yeah, me too.

David, you and I were on the same page, and I was like “Oh, they’re gonna win!” and then I was like “Oh, s–”

I expected more people to say automation, for sure.

Yeah, automation was definitely on mine. So on mine I have “Tell a story”, and I have “lols.” Just for the lols. Because I’m trying to think of what silly stuff people put in this.

I think that’s the first one, the joy/fun.

Yeah, I would group that under joy.

So that just leaves me “Telling a story”, and… Yeah, I don’t know; this is a tough one. Because you’ve got – yeah, ends meet, making money, you’ve got job security… So it’s like – that one kind of wraps up family security, or whatever; like, “I write software because it’s like a stable tech job.” Or maybe that’s it, it’s stable. Software is perceptively stable…? I don’t know.

What do you think, Una?

Are we allowed to talk on this one?

Yeah. This is a steal.

Oh. I wasn’t sure. Okay, I have some thoughts… I mean, my first thought is like, you know, the money, the benefits…

Get rich.

…that’s probably included in the job, all those reasons. I also think the impact of making software, reaching people, kind of making a difference… The way that you can work on something that a lot of people use - it feels like there’s purpose to it.

Yeah, I’m wondering if that’s in problem-solving. I was thinking the same thing, and I didn’t know if –

But I don’t think it is, because of the way Jerod responded to that answer… [laughs]

Are you trying to read my eyes? [laughter] I’m over here – I’m on Reddit, so I don’t know what you guys are talking about.

I think that the logic aspect of it is like the challenge, but the impact aspect of it is like why do you do that.

Impact is a good one.

Alright. Should we go with that?

Impact, making a difference?

Okay, so set the stage, we have Keyframers with 136, CSS Podcast with 206… These points are theirs unless you can steal it. You have three opportunities on the board; you guessed impact. We already have joy, money, puzzles… What else could be possibly on there? Is impact on the board? [win alert] Yes, it is!

It’s grouped into “Satisfaction, accomplishment and impact.” Six people said that; that’s 12 points. That’s a steal, that’s all the points… And once again, the CSS Podcast defend this time their championship. You are the winner once again. Congratulations!

That made an impact, Una. Well done! [laughter]

Let’s clear the rest of this board, just for the lols… Number four was creativity…

Oh, nice. Okay.

…or craft, or hobby. They do it as a hobby. Sometimes you’re like “Isn’t that fun?” Yeah, but they said the word hobby, not the word fun… So trying to keep them in separate categories there.

Number five, curiosity and interest. Again, somewhat related to problem-solving and challenges, but they were using these words, so we let them stand on their own two feet. A couple other - four people said love, Adam.

Alright… It’s cool…

[46:01] So you were close. Two people said passion, which maybe you could put in with love and make a category, but I didn’t… Two people love the magic…

That all feels like it goes together…

One said laziness…

Magic, love, passion…

Yeah. Laziness and automation…

And of course, stubbornness is back; our stubbornness answer reoccurs… So that rounds out our game. So at the end of six rounds, CSS Podcast - 312. Keyframers - you guys played a heck of a game; it came down to it at the very end, but at the end of the day, CSS Pod, champs once again. Congrats!

Good job.

Good job, Shaw and David. You killed it.

Thank you… We won’t be bitter.

I still like your source control answer. [laughter]

Thank you. This audience just needs to get on board.

They do, they really do. Especially the Ruby guy.

The Ruby guy. Come on, Ruby guy…

Well, I couldn’t remember any runtimes at the beginning of this… I was just stuck.

Yeah, that was tough. It was tough.

So at the end of the Super Bowl they interview the winning team and they ask them very heartfelt questions, and so I will do that now with Una and Adam. Adam, you’ve put your heart out there today, you had some silly answers, you had some sarcastic ones that really hit… I feel like you really reverberated with our audience, if that’s even the right word, which it’s not… What was your emotion when you realized that this final answer was correct? What did you feel out there?

Thanks, Jerod. When I came into that final question - you know, I was listening to Una, I was listening to all the options, and I really just had to internalize… [sipping noise 00:47:23.15] That’s me sipping Gatorade.


But you know what - as soon as she said “impact”, I knew it, I felt it to my core. It was just so obvious, and so we went with that. And now we won! Oh, yeahhh!! Aaahh!! [laughter]

I love Adam’s Super Bowl voice. Oh, he left the screen… He’s out of frame… [laughter]

He’s gone. He’s going to Disneyland, yeah. Una… You know, at the end there we thought we had maybe a fumble, you didn’t realize you could even talk… And so Adam’s over there, you left him on an island, no communication… He’s fumbling and bumbling, he’s saying things that don’t make any sense… And then out of nowhere, at the very end, you swoop in and you bring your logic and reasoning… What motivated you to swoop in at the end there?

Well, I’ve gotta say, it’s a team effort; I wanted to make sure my teammate had a platform, was able to get out what’s on his mind… And honestly, I was a little silly in that moment. But here we are… All that matters is we made it in the end. We made it in the end, my friend. We ended up on top! [laughter]

I’m on a chair, I can’t run. [laughs]

Very good. Well, I would ask you what you’re gonna do with the winnings, but of course, there aren’t any, because this is a silly game show…

We’re going to Disneyland!!

…made by silly people, on a silly podcast…

Oh, we’re not going to Disneyland…?

You can go to Disneyland if you like… It’s just gonna cost you quite a bit, I believe, as it’s a hot place to travel these days. Well, Keyframer guys - thanks so much for playing. David and Shaw, it was a valiant effort. We really appreciate that. Of course, CSS Podcast, you’re invited back to defend your championship the next time, as we asked 30 questions on this survey, and we only used six. So we have a lot left in the barrel so to speak, and we don’t have to nag our listeners to play some more games… So that’s very cool.

Of course, one of our listeners will be drawn at random for that free JS Party T-shirt, one of the people that took the survey, so stay tuned for that. We’ll probably announce it in our Slack, and I’ll also just email you if you’re the winner. If you’re not the winner and you want some of that sweet, sweet swag, merch.changelog.com, of course. Go get yourself a T-shirt.

But yeah, this has been Frontend Feud, another awesome battle. I’ve been Jerod, this is JS Party, and thanks, y’all. We’ll talk to you y’all next time.

Boop, boop-boop-booop-boop-boop, boop, boop-boop-booop-boop-boop… Boop. [laughter]


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